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[bowhunter1023]

HA! Buncha fucks!!!

I'm here to tell you right now that this convinces me that the Farm Bureau and the insurance companies are pumping money in to the DNR. How much money do you think the DNR stands to loose with a shit deer herd? Millions. But if you supplement that loss via special interest donations, well then it is no longer a big deal. As hunters, we are getting beaten, raped, pillaged, and lied to. Massive crock of shit...

I know this post makes me sound like a ranting lunatic and sometimes, that is the effect I am looking for as I'm not nearly that high strung. However, I want to elaborate on what I was hinting at here...

According to Mr. Scott Zody, Chief of the Ohio Division of Wildlife as published in 2013 Wildlife Calender from Wild Ohio Magazine, the DOW experienced a 5 million dollar deficit in the 2012 fiscal year. With 2012 expenditures at $64,567,206 and 2012 revenue at $59,565,999, I think we can see that the DOW is just as good at managing a budget as they are a deer herd.

This lends itself to three questions in my mind:

How does a man who manages a multi-million dollar government agency who received government funding, retain his job when he operates on a deficit? I know, he just follows our Czar's lead...

Would doubling non-resident license and tag fees completely close this gap? The numbers are there and this can be answered with a little math...

If he does keep his job and no one is interested in worrying about closing this budget gap, then I am inclined to think there are lobbyist dollars at work which are not showing up on the books. How can we expose that if it is indeed true?

 

[Jackalope]

I know this post makes me sound like a ranting lunatic and sometimes, that is the effect I am looking for as I'm not nearly that high strung. However, I want to elaborate on what I was hinting at here...

According to Mr. Scott Zody, Chief of the Ohio Division of Wildlife as published in 2013 Wildlife Calender from Wild Ohio Magazine, the DOW experienced a 5 million dollar deficit in the 2012 fiscal year. With 2012 expenditures at $64,567,206 and 2012 revenue at $59,565,999, I think we can see that the DOW is just as good at managing a budget as they are a deer herd.

This lends itself to three questions in my mind:

How does a man who manages a multi-million dollar government agency who received government funding, retain his job when he operates on a deficit? I know, he just follows our Czar's lead...

Would doubling non-resident license and tag fees completely close this gap? The numbers are there and this can be answered with a little math...

If he does keep his job and no one is interested in worrying about closing this budget gap, then I am inclined to think there are lobbyist dollars at work which are not showing up on the books. How can we expose that if it is indeed true?

It would be very difficult to show departmental budgets being supplemented by lobbying dollars. Typically that doesn't happen because it's easy to uncover. Usually they don't influence departmental budgets but rather contacts, contracts, and kickbacks to individuals. The only way it can impact departmental budgets is if the department gets the lobbying organization to pay for something.. As an example. Say the DNR needs to put a fence up along a busy section of road. It's not in the budget and they don't want to pay for it. The lobbying organization will step in and do it, they'll put the fence up.. Then it's "collaboration" and the organization did a "good deed" for everyone. It's very hard to prove "influence" in situations like that.

 

[Lundy]

From what I hear, reducing tags or seasons will not help you if you have a pack of amish hunting close to you. Most don't recognize seasons or tag limits anyway.

Hey, I am not Amish, don't even know any Amish, but I think they might be unfairly singled out. I think they have plenty of company in that group

There is not a chance in hell that any group of Amish could be any more kill happy, brown it's down, fill as many tags as permitted, party hunting, shooting deer for other hunters to tag, than the group of yahoo local redneck hillbillies that hunt around me. Add to them the city slicker hunters with all of their "bone collector" stuff that wouldn't know that they had hit a deer with a shot unless it fell over dead in sight of them. If I offend some with my redneck hillbilly reference it is only to illustrate that we should not paint all with such a broad brush, I'm sure there are a few good redneck hillbilly’s

There is a picture, on another hunting site, that shows a big group of guys standing for a picture with their 2 day gun harvest this past weekend. They are getting a bunch of “good job” type responses. I can’t help but wonder what the responses would be if those were a bunch of Amish guys in the picture standing over all of those deer.

 

[bowhunter1023]

I'm sure there are a few good redneck hillbilly’s

Damn straight! But I prefer Redneck. Hillbillies come from WV. lmao

 

[jagermeister]

I know this post makes me sound like a ranting lunatic and sometimes, that is the effect I am looking for as I'm not nearly that high strung. However, I want to elaborate on what I was hinting at here...

According to Mr. Scott Zody, Chief of the Ohio Division of Wildlife as published in 2013 Wildlife Calender from Wild Ohio Magazine, the DOW experienced a 5 million dollar deficit in the 2012 fiscal year. With 2012 expenditures at $64,567,206 and 2012 revenue at $59,565,999, I think we can see that the DOW is just as good at managing a budget as they are a deer herd.

This lends itself to three questions in my mind:

How does a man who manages a multi-million dollar government agency who received government funding, retain his job when he operates on a deficit? I know, he just follows our Czar's lead...

Would doubling non-resident license and tag fees completely close this gap? The numbers are there and this can be answered with a little math...

If he does keep his job and no one is interested in worrying about closing this budget gap, then I am inclined to think there are lobbyist dollars at work which are not showing up on the books. How can we expose that if it is indeed true?

You're making quite a few assumptions based solely on two numbers. For all you/we know, the DNR could have experienced substantial cuts from Federal funding, which could easily result in a 5 mil deficit. There are government entities all over the country right now that are doing all they can to slash expenditures, attempting to stop the bleeding caused by revocation of federal and state dollars. It may or may not be the case with the DNR. But just know that it's a very good possibility.

 

[Jackalope]

You're making quite a few assumptions based solely on two numbers. For all you/we know, the DNR could have experienced substantial cuts from Federal funding, which could easily result in a 5 mil deficit. There are government entities all over the country right now that are doing all they can to slash expenditures, attempting to stop the bleeding caused by revocation of federal and state dollars. It may or may not be the case with the DNR. But just know that it's a very good possibility.

Yes. But they ran about a million dollar deficit last year planning on an extra million dollars from the feds this year. There was an article about it early this year. They were a million in the red but said it was ok because they had a money coming from the feds for something this year. I forget what that "something" was, but it was a one time thing they normally don't get. So I'm sure they had budgetary issues. But they also cashed a Payday load last year hoping for a payday this year. Not saying that's it. But it's not a smart idea in these times.

 

[bowhunter1023]

They received $15.2 million in additional funding form the Feds in 2012. So you are saying the DOW can blame the federal government for failing to operate within their means?

 

[Ohiosam]

I've lost track of time but I'm pretty sure Strickland was governor and I think it was 2009 or 10. The governor ordered all state agencies to cut their budget by X%. The DoW had to do the same even though almost all it's money is from licenses, fines and Pittman-Robertson. The money saved couldn't go to the general fund so it just sat in the DoW's account. So I wonder if the deficits now were to use up funds just sitting around? If not where did the $$ come from?

 

[jagermeister]

They received $15.2 million in additional funding form the Feds in 2012. So you are saying the DOW can blame the federal government for failing to operate within their means?

Not necessarily. Like a lot of other agencies, it's possible that the DOW's budget is planned/determined based on the past fiscal year. What can you really do when your budget is based on money that's been coming in for years and all of a sudden it's taken away?

Listen... I'm not saying this is or isn't the case. None of us really know. I'm just wondering how we go from bashing deer management decisions to then bashing money management decisions, without even knowing what all goes into calculating their budget. It wouldn't surprise me if every Division of the DNR was operating in the red in 2012. Look around this country... operating in the red is a pretty common situation these days. It doesn't necessarily point to incompetence.

 

[bowhunter1023]

What I find most intriguing is that Zody did not even acknowledge the deficit, let alone offer an explanation. That's intriguing to me. It appeared to be brushed off...

 

[jagermeister]

What I find most intriguing is that Zody did not even acknowledge the deficit, let alone offer an explanation. That's intriguing to me. It appeared to be brushed off...

Would you want to draw attention to the fact that the organization you're the Chief of is operating in the red? I know I wouldn't.

 

[bowhunter1023]

Would you want to draw attention to the fact that the organization you're the Chief of is operating in the red? I know I wouldn't.

He printed it right next to his mini-dissertation in bright, colored graphics and mailed it to every person who subscribes to Wild Ohio Magazine. So much for not drawing attention to it...

 

[hickslawns]

Hey, I am not Amish, don't even know any Amish, but I think they might be unfairly singled out. I think they have plenty of company in that group

Fair enough. I won't argue this at all. They certainly have help.

There is not a chance in hell that any group of Amish could be any more kill happy, brown it's down, fill as many tags as permitted, party hunting, shooting deer for other hunters to tag, than the group of yahoo local redneck hillbillies that hunt around me. Add to them the city slicker hunters with all of their "bone collector" stuff that wouldn't know that they had hit a deer with a shot unless it fell over dead in sight of them. If I offend some with my redneck hillbilly reference it is only to illustrate that we should not paint all with such a broad brush, I'm sure there are a few good redneck hillbilly’s

There is a picture, on another hunting site, that shows a big group of guys standing for a picture with their 2 day gun harvest this past weekend. They are getting a bunch of “good job” type responses. I can’t help but wonder what the responses would be if those were a bunch of Amish guys in the picture standing over all of those deer.

You are correct. There are many rotten apples out there. It is not only the amish. On the flip side, there are some fine/upstanding amish out there as well that are not bad people. Unfortunately, they have to live in the shadows of many of their counterparts which have complete disregard for the rules.

 

[Lundy]

If you set the tags back at 3 you'll only save 6,028 deer.. That's not enough. While it needs to be done, it is only a small part of the answer.

Is there really a need or justification for a 3 deer limit in any counties other than a few urban areas? Isn't a 2 deer limit where we need to go, at least for a while?

Add the other 8,500 (3rd deer)deer to the 6,000 deer(4 and above deer harvest) and you have the same number as the 2 day gun season harvest savings. If everyone is convinced on one why not do both?

ALL of the extra tags deer (minus buttons and sheds) are females needed to repopulate.

Or we could do what the DNR wants and add a 2 day DOE only season statewide, fuggwads!

 

[Jackalope]

Is there really a need or justification for a 3 deer limit in any counties other than a few urban areas? Isn't a 2 deer limit where we need to go, at least for a while?

Add the other 8,500 (3rd deer)deer to the 6,000 deer(4 and above deer harvest) and you have the same number as the 2 day gun season harvest savings. If everyone is convinced on one why not do both?

ALL of the extra tags deer (minus buttons and sheds) are females needed to repopulate.

Or we could do what the DNR wants and add a 2 day DOE only season statewide, fuggwads!

That's my perspective. Do both.. I would actually like to see three things.. Take the tags to 3, 2, 1, remove bonus gun, and start bow on Oct 15th.. Let that go for a year or two and see where we're at. But the main thing they need to quit doing is guessing the population of live deer by counting dead deer.

The only problem I see with it is I'm willing to bet most of those 4-6 deer are killed in areas that can support it. Urban or lightly hunted areas booming with deer. So I don't think a simple tag reduction is enough. It's not going to slow down the guys shooting 3 in areas that can't support it. By guys i mean them as a collective not individuals.

 

[Gordo]

Are there that many deer harvested before october 15th??? I know many of people dont want to mess with a dead deer in that kind of heat

 

[jagermeister]

Are there that many deer harvested before october 15th??? I know many of people dont want to mess with a dead deer in that kind of heat

This year, hunters harvested almost 20,000 deer by October 16th.

http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/portals/9/pdf/deer%20harvest/OCT%2016%202012.pdf

 

[Lundy]

Joe,

Are you saying you support 3 tags in some areas other than urban areas?

 

[brock ratcliff]

Seems everyone but the DOW has a plan to rebuild the herd.

I would be in favor of simply using the system that built the herd - be a little more conservative on tags and opportunity.

 

[Jackalope]

Joe,

Are you saying you support 3 tags in some areas other than urban areas?

I'm saying that's not off the table. But a solid population estimate would need to be done. I'm not so close minded that i don't believe there are areas that can support three tags. There are.. It also depends on if they redraw the urban zone maps. I have a feeling most of those areas will lay close to existing zones. I'm not saying 3 should be the norm right now, but it shouldn't be off the table. If we raise the population back up then we should be able to maintain a 3 tag system in southern counties no problem.