No mans land
- Thread starter Jackalope
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That's just backstrapping a deer. That's not what most who know deer anatomy call no mans land. I'm sure there are those that say they hit it but really back strapped the deer. In the correct sense it's below the spine and above/high in the vitals. Red cloud pointed it out perfectly. Shoot a deer there and you're tracking a live deer.
IMO, this "no mans land" being questioned is like Jake said, "over used". I believe it exists but very narrow though. I believe it is only a few inches wide and is below the spine and above solid lung tissue. In other words a portion on the top of the lungs are in the "no mans land". The organs within the diaphragm do lay low due to gravity(settling) and any extreme high hits to the lungs(skimming the tops) and also missing the spine(below) is what I believe is the "NML".
I also believe shots from elevated tree stands lessens the chance of a deer getting away from a "NML" hit due to the angle. Penetration and broadhead effectiveness are very important factors as well!
I also believe shots from elevated tree stands lessens the chance of a deer getting away from a "NML" hit due to the angle. Penetration and broadhead effectiveness are very important factors as well!
Gordo
Senior Member
I'm no doctor of deer anatomy thats for sure.
Ive also never heard the term 'back strapping' a deer.
Ive always referred to what your talking about as 'clipping the top of the lungs'. Or in simple terms, 'High Lung Shot'. Interesting
Thats what I'm saying . In my opinion when someone says they hit no mans land in my mind I automatically assume they backstrapped it . While odd things can happen very very few deer survive a arrow in the chest . People are to proud to admit the made a shitty shot and instead wanna blame it on the mythical no man's land" to save face .
I tell ya, the more pics and diagrams you guys throw up to prove the existence of "no mans land" the more I'm losing my belief in it. I'm just having a hard time seeing it now. I know I've shot 2 deer right where the circle is on redcloud's pic and they both flopped over dead pretty quick. I'm with Carpn on this... I bet most hunters who claim to have hit NML didn't hit the chest cavity at all.
Gordo
Senior Member
Y'all can debate this all you want... Bottom line it happens so there's something too it.... Otherwise how you explain it????? We've all seen it or know someone it has happened too....
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Precisely. We just have to admit that just because you hit them in the chest doesn't mean it's going to kill them. I've seed deer single lunged right in the pump house that lived through the season and were on cam the next spring. It's not impossible, not even doubtful that a deer can get hit high in the chest cavity and survive. They can and do. Many a used to be rage BH fans can tell you that. Look at that link I posted earlier. T-bone absolutely SMOKED that deer that Waddel shot. Textbook through and through. Waddel shot it many hours later and over 2,000 yards away. That deer would have lived. And he was shot right in the wheel house. If they can survive that they can sure survive high lung or no lung below the spine shots. No matter the name we call it. No mans land, whatever. It's been proven time and time again to be a survivable wound.
Like I said, level shots. From a tree or a downward angle your going to blow that lung instead of just grazing it. If a person can live with one lung so can animals. Heck a person can live with just half a lung. If the deer is exhauling when the arrow goes thru at the spot I marked you would be surprised to see a gap there. It can and has been done I'm sure of it. Do I believe every person that says they hit no mans land and lost a deer. Of course not but I do say it is able to be done. you also have to remember that straight edge clean cuts heal very quickly and clot very quickly compared to a jagged rough cut.
Ever read about people that get hit in the chest at the exact right time in the beat of their heart and die? Strange things can and will happen.
Hate to nitpick... And I know it's off topic... But clean cuts made by a sharp instrument actually bleed faster, clot slower, and heal slower than cuts made by dull jagged instruments. Dull blades create more cell damage than sharp blades, releasing more clot-causing enzymes in the blood. That's why we use razor sharp broadheads and not dull ones.
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We use sharp BH for the penetration factor and the ability to cut versus tear it's why into the animal causing less drag.
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To a point you're both right. Sharp vs dull wound sharp wins. Like he said a sharp cut bleeds faster and doesn't clot as quick due to less platelets being released. However I don't agree that sharp cuts necessarily take longer to heal. They tend to heal quicker than "dull" cuts. The reason is the sharp blades slice the micro capillaries, cells and meat so cleanly that they almost line back up and the wound is nice and even. There's actually less traumatic flesh damage to heal up and a more of a clean cut.
This goes out the window with serrated cuts though. They too can be razor sharp but they cut more jagged, they do a combo of cutting and ripping. Wounds from serrated cuts are a son of a bitch to close up and take longer to heal than clean slices, they do however tend to clot quicker than clean cuts due to the extra release of playlets.
This goes out the window with serrated cuts though. They too can be razor sharp but they cut more jagged, they do a combo of cutting and ripping. Wounds from serrated cuts are a son of a bitch to close up and take longer to heal than clean slices, they do however tend to clot quicker than clean cuts due to the extra release of playlets.
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Lmao
Here's some good reading... For everyone who bowhunts
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...jAGOB4&usg=AFQjCNHZ75-FxCUy6aR2GWAWuUyE4iKEcg
Sorry its a PDF. Go to this link and click on"Getting an Edge on Success."
http://www.tradjournal.com/index.php/articles2/10-ashby-reports/1-the-dr-ed-ashby-reports
http://www.tradjournal.com/index.php/articles2/10-ashby-reports/1-the-dr-ed-ashby-reports
