Formula for Succes.

[Jackalope]

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If you had to list the formula for success of killing big bucks year in year out, what weight would you give to the major contributing factors.

In my opinion it looks like this.

80% Access to property that contains said bucks year in year out.
10%. Available time to spend hunting said bucks.
10% hunting prowess of the individual.


Basically. 90% of the equation is having a property that contains good bucks and having the available time to hunt them. Personally I believe the hunter himself is only about 10% of the equation. Now granted it takes some time to locate those properties and actually gain access, but I think that falls more under access than hunter prowess. I am thoroughly convinced that you can take just about any hunter and put him on a property with good bucks and he's going to kill a good one given enough time. If he's on the right property, with enough time, even a complete newbie would kill good bucks. Take high fence operations for instance. The main factor to success is the number of bucks on the property, and time given to the hunter to hunt them. As long as those two conditions exist really just about any idiot can kill one. This s the same reason these TV personalities write checks to outfitters, They already have the available time, they just need access.

So what say you?

 

[CritterGitterToo]

I'm not sure I fully understand your format, but I'll give these 4 keys:

1. Having access to land that a mature buck resides on and nobody else has access to it. No other hunters, no dog walkers, no squirrel hunters and joggers, kids or any other human beings.

2. Being able to get into multiple key spots undetected.

3. Understanding escape routes from neighboring properties.

4. Having time available to hunt.

You lock in all 4 of those keys and there is no reason you shouldn't be able to harvest that mature buck in a year. I'm assuming said hunter is a decent shot as well.

 

[Milo]

There are rarities like Roger rothaar who killed his big bucks on ground other people had permission to hunt also but he is a 1% er and probably a 0.1% in reality. He shares his knowledge in his book and its an amazing the clues he picks up on.

 

[giblet]

.

If you had to list the formula for success of killing big bucks year in year out, what weight would you give to the major contributing factors.

In my opinion it looks like this.

80% Access to property that contains said bucks year in year out.
10%. Available time to spend hunting said bucks.
10% hunting prowess of the individual.


Basically. 90% of the equation is having a property that contains good bucks and having the available time to hunt them. Personally I believe the hunter himself is only about 10% of the equation. Now granted it takes some time to locate those properties and actually gain access, but I think that falls more under access than hunter prowess. I am thoroughly convinced that you can take just about any hunter and put him on a property with good bucks and he's going to kill a good one given enough time. If he's on the right property, with enough time, even a complete newbie would kill good bucks. Take high fence operations for instance. The main factor to success is the number of bucks on the property, and time given to the hunter to hunt them. As long as those two conditions exist really just about any idiot can kill one. This s the same reason these TV personalities write checks to outfitters, They already have the available time, they just need access.

So what say you?

I agree with your assessment but property alone won’t cut it. Unpressured deer is what I want. I don’t see incidental human contact as the problem with pressure either. There isn’t a deer alive east of the Mississippi that doesn’t have multiple human contacts throughout the year…all year. What gets the deer on alert is what the people are doing when contact is made. Start creeping around the woods like Rambo, get busted sitting up in a tree, ride a 4 wheeler back in and turn it off instead of the circle you did all summer, pay special attention to a deer once you see him maybe with binoculars or trying for a picture…….now you’ve got a deer on code red. Multiply that by a factor of ten and you’re going to have a nocturnal deer with minimal daytime movement in short order.

 

[finelyshedded]

ACCESS-Property has to have big bucks to hunt and kill big bucks. The more big bucks that frequent the property the better your chances are to harvest one. Have exclusive rights would be HUGE, thus that's why guys with money lease up prime land. If you share prime land with others then your chances of success also diminishes some but it's better than nothing, right? Lol
TIME-Regardless of prime property or not if you don't have a lot of time to spend hunting for big bucks your chances of killing one decreases dramatically! Ideally, if one could hunt the last week in October through Ohio's gun season they'd probably stand a great chance in tagging a mature buck every year as well.
SKILL-There's different degrees of it amongst the hunting community! Shooting ability,reading sign,preparation,patience and the ability to hold ones composure at the moment of truth.

IMO, the first two are most important as even the worst shot and least knowledgable hunter in the world can and will luck themselves into a doozy every now and then. If you have do have the first two you should be able to get it done every year, IMO.

Since Joe and everybody else is putting a % breakdown on the major factors I might as well TOO.

To be able to hunt and harvest a mature buck every year I'd put it like this:

ACCESS-33.33%
TIME-33.33%
SKILL-33.33%

 

[Carpn]

Obviously access to decent land is important . But I'd only go be it 30-40 , having time to hunt gets the same percent , and hunter prowess gets the same 30-40 . I know some people with great land , who can't consistency kill big deer .

 

[xbowguy]

I don't know enough to actually divide it up. I will agree that access to the right property and the time to put on stand, plays an awful big part. Add the right wind direction and it's 80+% IMO.

 

[Jackalope]

Obviously access to decent land is important . But I'd only go be it 30-40 , having time to hunt gets the same percent , and hunter prowess gets the same 30-40 . I know some people with great land , who can't consistency kill big deer .

But is it because they don't have enough ass in a stand time. I think it's a sliding scale. The better the property, and more time someone has, the less skilled they have to be. On the contrary if you have a great property with a great hunter who has no time to hunt, it slides the other way. But I really think that if you have a great property and a good amount of time to sit, you can be a complete dumbass and still kill a good deer. You could take Larry king and put him on the Kiskys place and he'll drag out a slob if he sits there enough.

 

[hickslawns]

Access is easily 50-80%.
Time to hunt is key.
Hunter prowess? Good question. I have seen guys who put in all sorts of time but go about it all wrong. I think "poor" hunters (and I use this term loosely) can ruin a great property. Just because a property holds great bucks doesn't mean you can go bumbling around, leaving scent all over, hunt it day in/day out regardless of wind, etc.

I would say an average to good hunter can have success on a "good" property if they have time to hunt it and hunt it right. Then again, I have seen guys I consider good hunters, who have access to good ground. . .Fail to capitalize. It is hunting. Sometimes you do everything right and it doesn't work out. Then there are guys who do everything wrong and stumble into good bucks every few years.

 

[giles]

I must not be made out to kill big bucks. I like to hunt with other people. Every property I hunt is hunted by multiple other people. I think ass in the stand and location are key though. You can have the best property out there, if your not in the right place at the right time, it's all for nothing.

 

[bowhunter1023]

I have a lot more to add to this when I have time. But I want to put this out there now. Years ago, on a forum far, far away, another member (who has since road off in to the sunset) told me that I'd never consistently kill big bucks until I "quit fucking around helping others". His advice, if I was going to be successful on an annual basis, it had to be all about me. No sharing property. No helping others. No filming. No nothing but focusing on me and whatever buck(s) I wanted to kill.

Years later, I'm not successful consistently and when I look at some of the prime examples of those that are, it's apparent his advice was spot on. If it's all about you, you're more likely to succeed. If you look at the world's most successful people, as a group, they are largely unlikable, selfish people. I'd say it's safe to say the thing about perennially successful deer hunters...

 

["J"]

I must not be made out to kill big bucks. I like to hunt with other people. Every property I hunt is hunted by multiple other people. I think ass in the stand and location are key though. You can have the best property out there, if your not in the right place at the right time, it's all for nothing.

Join the club, I'm not or probably will ever be a big buck hunter.... If one strolls through a set up I've chosen due too my experience.... Great, hopefully it'll be an ethical shot with a quick kill.... But odds aren't in my favor of that happening.... But helping other folks, wether hanging stands, trailing a bad hit, or doing some drives during gun season.... That's where I find the enjoyment the most the last decade or so.... I still love hitting the stand by myself, setting up on a good spot and waiting them out.... But I had more fun on the deer drives at the orchard and the muzzy hunt with all you folks..... I enjoy the cocmoradery more as I age I guess lol....

 

[brock ratcliff]

I have a lot more to add to this when I have time. But I want to put this out there now. Years ago, on a forum far, far away, another member (who has since road off in to the sunset) told me that I'd never consistently kill big bucks until I "quit fucking around helping others". His advice, if I was going to be successful on an annual basis, it had to be all about me. No sharing property. No helping others. No filming. No nothing but focusing on me and whatever buck(s) I wanted to kill.

Years later, I'm not successful consistently and when I look at some of the prime examples of those that are, it's apparent his advice was spot on. If it's all about you, you're more likely to succeed. If you look at the world's most successful people, as a group, they are largely unlikable, selfish people. I'd say it's safe to say the thing about perennially successful deer hunters...

I'll agree with this. I know I killed nice deer on a lot more consistent basis back when it was just me getting in the truck to hunt. That being said, I don't think I'd even hunt much now if it were still just me getting in the truck...

I remember when Mason was about 6. I had been watching a good buck in a bean field on a pretty regular basis. I had a set up just for that deer. Opening weekend of season rolled around and I wasn't able to get out the first night. On the second day, I had the choice of going in and hunting that deer or taking Mason to a blind where we could see that field, but would have no hope of killing that buck. I spoke with a guy regarding my situation. He said to go hunt this deer, plenty of season left to take Mason. This guy has killed a lot more big deer than most of us here, and I knew he was right. I took Mason to the blind and along with a lot of other deer, we watched that bug sucker walk right under my stand I had set to kill him. Hands down, one of the best hunts Mason and I have ever had together. That was the first "big" buck he had ever seen in the wild. I made the right choice.

 

[Carpn]

But is it because they don't have enough ass in a stand time. I think it's a sliding scale. The better the property, and more time someone has, the less skilled they have to be. On the contrary if you have a great property with a great hunter who has no time to hunt, it slides the other way. But I really think that if you have a great property and a good amount of time to sit, you can be a complete dumbass and still kill a good deer. You could take Larry king and put him on the Kiskys place and he'll drag out a slob if he sits there enough.

To a degree yes, but how many of those top shelf properties are around ? I'm sure there are places like that which exist but they are the exception to the rule , and I've never been fortunate enough to hunt one of them . The average hunter in Ohio has to overcome a lot of things out of their control , and get lucky to consistently kill big deer . Sometimes luck plays a big part , sometimes it only plays a small part . But after dealing with repeated back luck this yr it was the only thing I could tell myself to keep my sanity and keep hunting.

 

[Muzzy Moment]

I may agree with your original post of we are talking about stand hunting only. I myself think it is a different world when it comes to still hunting. I have learned from one of the best and that's the only way I hunt most of the time. Whether it be spot and stalk or try and cut them off. In my opinion when hunting from the ground experience and knowledge are key.

 

[Carpn]

Keeping your shit together and making a good shot is also a important part in the equation not to be overlooked.

 

[Jackalope]

Keeping your shit together and making a good shot is also a important part in the equation not to be overlooked.

Yep. But without a property that has bucks, or the time to be in the stand when he strolls by, it doesn't matter if you can double lung one at 200 yards.

 

[Carpn]

Yep. But without a property that has bucks, or the time to be in the stand when he strolls by, it doesn't matter if you can double lung one at 200 yards.

Of course , but it doesn't matter if you get repeated chances if ya screw em up either . There's extremes to every argument . I just trying to focus on the middle ground .

 

[Jackalope]

Of course , but it doesn't matter if you get repeated chances if ya screw em up either . There's extremes to every argument . I just trying to focus on the middle ground .

But I don't think that is an extreme at all. The more shot opportunities you have the more you can suck and still be successful. The same cannot be said for a person who has zero shot opportunities because of a bad property but can double lung a deer at 200 yards. This a good property is still far more critical than good hunter ability.

 

[Big_Holla]

Time is my biggest factor. We've got decent land but being able to actually hunt it has been a different story, at least this year.