ODNR Ready for hunter's complaints

[Gern186]

I have not shot more than a few does in my entire life....maybe less than 8 combined between Indiana and Ohio...over the last 25 years. My uncles would rather take a beating than to shoot a doe. Most of my buddies don't shoot does. There are a lot of does available in my immediate area...however there are parts of our county that get pounded with guys that have the just shoot a deer mentality. I guess we are fortunate right in this area to have a good number of available does to keep producing offspring and a future supply of bucks. In addition to that...we hunt the hell out of the coyotes...that has to help too...it can't hurt anything I know that. Unless we get hit with EHD or something like that...I don't see our deer herd diminishing very quick...there aren't enough guys killing does like what you guys are witnessing. Now as soon as I cross the state line over to Indiana...there are a LOT less deer over there...talk about a liberal state for killing antlerless deer!...they are much more liberal than Ohio is.

 

[Jackalope]

I have not shot more than a few does in my entire life....maybe less than 8 combined between Indiana and Ohio...over the last 25 years. My uncles would rather take a beating than to shoot a doe. Most of my buddies don't shoot does. There are a lot of does available in my immediate area...however there are parts of our county that get pounded with guys that have the just shoot a deer mentality. I guess we are fortunate right in this area to have a good number of available does to keep producing offspring and a future supply of bucks. In addition to that...we hunt the hell out of the coyotes...that has to help too...it can't hurt anything I know that. Unless we get hit with EHD or something like that...I don't see our deer herd diminishing very quick...there aren't enough guys killing does like what you guys are witnessing. Now as soon as I cross the state line over to Indiana...there are a LOT less deer over there...talk about a liberal state for killing antlerless deer!...they are much more liberal than Ohio is.

How many miles do you control with your uncles and buddies? The reason I ask is, just because you have a centralized population of does doesn't mean you will be able to maintain your buck population through those does making bucks. It is been extensively researched and universally accepted that bucks rarely stay in the area they were born past 1.5 years old. Radio collared button bucks have been shown to move 2-9 miles from their original birthplace before establishing their core area. I believe Mike Rex has even spoken of a study that DNR did on his property 20 or 30 years ago on this subject and the findings were the same. The button bucks that you pass up are not your future pope and young or Boners.

What does this mean in reality. It means that the doe population you strive to keep high, doesn't really benefit your immediate buck population from a breeding standpoint. The bucks those are producing leave your area. I understand that if you maintain a high doe population the bucks from other areas setting up a home range will prefer your area. However if you do not completely control the area within 2 to 9 miles around your core hunting area you do not control your buck population. So if within a 9 mile radius of your hunting property you have a decimation of the doe population there is little you can do on your property to maintain your buck population.

Now obviously this gets blown out of whack during the rut as bucks begin to look for areas with more does. Maintaining a higher localized doe population well obviously attract more bucks to your property during the rut. However this same still holds true for the amount of those bucks available.

 

[Gern186]

We don't control much...there are many different landowners within the 15 miles of creek that we hunt along...some parts get hunted more than others. It just seems as a general rule that there aren't as many guys killing does..just a handful that do...so out of a population of 100 does, maybe 30 get whacked...then the next year those 70 does produce 110 offspring or so..so far the balance has been maintained pretty well in our area. Now where I do most of my hunting there are a few uneducated guys that seem to want to fill all 4 tags...these areas have taken a big hit on deer sightings. It only takes a few guys of overharvesting for a year or 2 and sightings go way down. Last year my buck sightings were very bad...this year we saw a good number of bucks.

 

[COB-TY]

Gern you are one man! The Division wants Does DEAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And there are a hell of a lot folks doing the Divisions dirty work. YES does need to be taken but not as many as are now being killed. I started bow hunting back in 1970 and for many season only saw a very few deer and most were does. And the 1970's is right where the Division wants the herd!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Redhunter1012]

We don't control much...there are many different landowners within the 15 miles of creek that we hunt along...some parts get hunted more than others. It just seems as a general rule that there aren't as many guys killing does..just a handful that do...so out of a population of 100 does, maybe 30 get whacked...then the next year those 70 does produce 110 offspring or so..so far the balance has been maintained pretty well in our area. Now where I do most of my hunting there are a few uneducated guys that seem to want to fill all 4 tags...these areas have taken a big hit on deer sightings. It only takes a few guys of overharvesting for a year or 2 and sightings go way down. Last year my buck sightings were very bad...this year we saw a good number of bucks.

I think our areas are very similar. Not surprising being that we aren't far apart. Like I said, 5-6 years ago reality hit hard. It started with a few of us not shooting does, and the rest followed suit surprisingly. We have the healthiest herd in our area Ive seen since I moved here in 2005. Most of the lifetime locals agree. One advantage we have is our core group of guys do have a lot of control of a very large portion of our area. We have a great group of varmint hunters, and enough does get taken out to where the farmers don't complain. I think my area is definitely the outlier though. 2 years ago a 2 deer limit, Very few bowhunters after mid October, and mostly buck hunters come gun season

 

[Gern186]

I think our areas are very similar. Not surprising being that we aren't far apart. Like I said, 5-6 years ago reality hit hard. It started with a few of us not shooting does, and the rest followed suit surprisingly. We have the healthiest herd in our area Ive seen since I moved here in 2005. Most of the lifetime locals agree. One advantage we have is our core group of guys do have a lot of control of a very large portion of our area. We have a great group of varmint hunters, and enough does get taken out to where the farmers don't complain. I think my area is definitely the outlier though. 2 years ago a 2 deer limit, Very few bowhunters after mid October, and mostly buck hunters come gun season

Yes...sounds just like what we have here..there are of course a few guys that want the whitetail deer completely exterminated...mostly local farmers..but the conservation minded hunting guys like you mention are making a difference.

 

[yotehunter]

I agree Jesse....my kids and I did not shoot a single doe this year. We are doing our part as well. Believe me...my daughter wanted to shoot several does in bow season...I wouldn't let her..and she's only killed 2 deer so far. We could have filled several tags, but really...who needs that much deer meat anyhow...Personally, I like seeing buck movement during the rut...I don't target does...and neither does 75 percent of the guys I know that hunt deer.

You must be in a area of van wert county that is in the 5 percent category. I hunt some of eastern van wert county. And I know that the whole county isn't that way. In fact most of my coyote hunting is done in vw county and there is a section or two west of Delphos that holds deer at this time of year due too herding up and very limited pressure. These sections we hunt coyotes in and we hunt them alot. Five years ago it would be nothing to see 50 deer when we went through thse sections hunting coyotes.We hunted both of these sections the last two weeks and one day was 13 and the next was 15. And you can go for miles around these sections and not jump another deer till you get to mandale to the north, or Elgin to the south or too wren too the west or to my house at kendrick woods in Allen county to the east. You would be hard pressed to jump deer out of 1 out of 7 sections right now in vw county. Sure they are yarded up in pockets but what use to be 50 to 75 deer in these pockets this time of year is now 15 to 30. Like I said I'm glad you and your hunting buddies are doing the right thing but not all of vw county is that way. A group during last years gun season had twenty deer laying in the shed after gun season the shot every thing the seen. And they would have this year if they had the deer. But they didn't. This is my point. You and me may only shoot 1 buck or 1 doe and buck. But 95 percent of the people out there are going to hunt until they kill their limit. And the set limits are way to high in our counties I don't understand how you can argue that. We aren't asking for a deer behind every tree but I don't want our herd size to go back to what is was in the 80s. I don't think you truly due either. And if DNR don't do something soon it will be that way. And you may not see it yet, but you will mark my words. You will see it. Thats all we are saying here.

 

[yotehunter]

I've got guys around me that have filled 2 of their 3 tags and are still trying to fill their 3rd. They just don't get it! The time to be super hunter that can fill all tags is over in my opinion!

agree 100 percent.

 

[yotehunter]

I think we have killed over 1000 for a few years in a row now...all seasons combined. No influx of hunters that I am aware of, just a lot more available tags that should not be available IMO.

How many were other county deer tagged as vw co?

 

[Gern186]

You must be in a area of van wert county that is in the 5 percent category. I hunt some of eastern van wert county. And I know that the whole county isn't that way. In fact most of my coyote hunting is done in vw county and there is a section or two west of Delphos that holds deer at this time of year due too herding up and very limited pressure. These sections we hunt coyotes in and we hunt them alot. Five years ago it would be nothing to see 50 deer when we went through thse sections hunting coyotes.We hunted both of these sections the last two weeks and one day was 13 and the next was 15. And you can go for miles around these sections and not jump another deer till you get to mandale to the north, or Elgin to the south or too wren too the west or to my house at kendrick woods in Allen county to the east. You would be hard pressed to jump deer out of 1 out of 7 sections right now in vw county. Sure they are yarded up in pockets but what use to be 50 to 75 deer in these pockets this time of year is now 15 to 30. Like I said I'm glad you and your hunting buddies are doing the right thing but not all of vw county is that way. A group during last years gun season had twenty deer laying in the shed after gun season the shot every thing the seen. And they would have this year if they had the deer. But they didn't. This is my point. You and me may only shoot 1 buck or 1 doe and buck. But 95 percent of the people out there are going to hunt until they kill their limit. And the set limits are way to high in our counties I don't understand how you can argue that. We aren't asking for a deer behind every tree but I don't want our herd size to go back to what is was in the 80s. I don't think you truly due either. And if DNR don't do something soon it will be that way. And you may not see it yet, but you will mark my words. You will see it. Thats all we are saying here.

Dude...I don't hunt van wert county...lol I know there aren't shit for deer in van wert county...well...except for some parts of the western county. I have always said our limits are too high..why should we be a 4 deer county? I went to Findlay to the open house and voiced my opinion the first year they implemented it..and it fell under deaf ears. I watch and know more about our local deer population than the vast majority of guys out there...for lots of reasons. I get out and I pay attention. We hunt alot of coyotes all winter long, we pay attention to tracks...I know where the deer are and how many of them there are...and where they are herded up at.

Here is a pretty picture from last evening...

 

[finelyshedded]

Wow Chad! I can honestly say I've never seen a herd of deer anywhere near that size with my own eyes anywhere on my travels over my lifetime here in the southern parts of Ohio....ever! WOW

 

[Gern186]

No big deal really....there were only about 40 of them. Last year at this time the herd was 3x bigger...lol...but that was due to the extreme cold and deep snow. This year the herds are spread out a little more because food is a lot easier for them to get to.

 

[finelyshedded]

I was amazed at the pics you shared in the past years of your yarded up herds up your way! Difference in terrain and woodland I'm sure but even in some of our largest at fields I've never seen herds that size!

 

[finelyshedded]

No big deal really....there were only about 40 of them. Last year at this time the herd was 3x bigger...lol...but that was due to the extreme cold and deep snow. This year the herds are spread out a little more because food is a lot easier for them to get to.

Still, the largest I ever saw in my life were 24 head or so and I thought that was amazing!! They yard up your way like they do out west in big sky country!lol

 

[Gern186]

I think that you guys have the same thing going on with the herds down where you are at..but there is so much cover that you don't always have a way of seeing them or locating them. I think the deer that herd up here come from as many as 15 miles away. Right now I know of 4 different herds within 5 miles...ranging from around 30 head to 60 head.

 

[Redhunter1012]

I think that you guys have the same thing going on with the herds down where you are at..but there is so much cover that you don't always have a way of seeing them or locating them. I think the deer that herd up here come from as many as 15 miles away. Right now I know of 4 different herds within 5 miles...ranging from around 30 head to 60 head.

Where I cut my teeth in southern Wood county, this is the norm as well. Exact same terrain. Flat as hell and you literally can see a herd of deer from a couple miles away running during gun season. It is pretty exciting to have a herd of 30-40 deer barreling across open terrain right at you

 

[brock ratcliff]

We have the exact same terrain in Fayette Co... and winter herd there will be as large as 6...

 

[Gern186]

We have the exact same terrain in Fayette Co... and winter herd there will be as large as 6...

Do you have a bunch of yotes there still? Because if the terrain is the same as here...I know a few guys that could do some damage on them if given the chance.

 

[brock ratcliff]

Yes we do. I have access to quite a bit of land, but not continuous tracts that would be large enough to hunt as you fellas do.

 

[Kaiser878]

Last year the night jen shot her Buck, he was the 20th deer we seen and it was still an hour before dark.....

Two years ago when I was hunting behind my dads I had 36 different deer come through and and at one time had over 20 in front of me..... this time of year is awesome to see large groups..... but its mostly a false sense of security because its all the deer from neighboring properties..... the power of a truck load of corn..... ha