Labor rates and wages?

[Jamie]

Also, in my experience, you don't want to attract customers that are looking for the lowest price. Leave the low hanging fruit and hassle to someone else. Your prices will reflect your potential customer base.

This.

Supply and demand ultimately control the free market in our wonderful capitalist society. A customer "win" is not getting cheaper labor at your expense. Customer truly wins by hiring someone competent that they trust for a price they are willing to pay. You win by becoming the guy who can charge whatever he feels is appropriate to do the job right because of his reputation and experience. Sacrificing your own earnings/wages/success in the name of morality and fairness because you feel bad about making good money is dumb. Sorry to be so blunt, but business is business. On being fair, like Mike said, just be honest. Be honest with yourself first, though.

 

[finelyshedded]

This.

Supply and demand ultimately control the free market in our wonderful capitalist society. A customer "win" is not getting cheaper labor at your expense. Customer truly wins by hiring someone competent that they trust for a price they are willing to pay. You win by becoming the guy who can charge whatever he feels is appropriate to do the job right because of his reputation and experience. Sacrificing your own earnings/wages/success in the name of morality and fairness because you feel bad about making good money is dumb. Sorry to be so blunt, but business is business. On being fair, like Mike said, just be honest. Be honest with yourself first, though.

^^^^this^^^^

…….and if you want to give more to church/charity then do so. Pray on it and he’ll give you direction and peace I’m sure.

 

[Jackalope]

Ughhh. Hi. Asshole here.

The biggest problem is that most homeowners have no business owning a home and have no clue how to do simple shit anymore. I don't mean because they haven't done it before, I mean, they're mentally incapable of even learning. Zero mechanical aptitude. Can't even follow a youtube video.

The other problem is people believing they're worth more than they are. Like getting a quote of $900 to replace a toilet. WTF. "I'm a union plumber" I don't give a fuck if you're the Queen of England's plumber, it's a fucking toilet. Two bolts and a water supply line to disconnect. Scrape out a wax ring, set a new one. Two bolts to secure the tank to the bowl and set it down. 2 hours labor max unless your a idiot. My fucking attorney, a guy with a law degree, who passed the bar, who present cases in a court of law is $250 an hour, you're just replacing a damn toilet and you want twice that.

Overhead and expenses have ZERO bearing on worth. Why do you charge $190 an hour? "Oh well I have a truck payment because I need dependable transportation, I have vehicle insurance to pay for, I needed a 12k trailer at 12% interest to haul my equipment, i need paid for my travel time there and back. I also have business insurance and personal health insurance, and I choose to pay workmans comp on myself, and I want to make an annual salary of 100K a year. When I do that math, I need to charge $190 an hour. Cool man, it sounds like you've got it all figured out then. What business do you own? Oh, I own PoopPickers LLC. I pick up dog shit in people's yards. "

Sorry, but to me, that's not "worth" it. The problem is that all these guys have been led to believe that they must have all this stuff as a minimum, leading to vastly overinflated overhead compared to the service they're actually providing. What happens then is across the board when you look for a service to pick up dog crap they're all $300-400 a month for 2 visits. Then the guy in the beat-up 2002 Chevy, who's 4 colors and has zero insurance or any of that overhead, raises his price to $300 also because he can. From there, it's just a rat race of prices. Then they all start getting less business and raise their prices yet again to make ends meet. Since covid, so many people have started a business in common fields that the market is saturated, leading to fewer jobs for each individual, as a result, they're all charging more for the jobs they do get.

Don't get me wrong. I am all for a man being able to make a living, but it has to be realistic and commiserate of the work being done. Bricklayers come to mind, fucking wizards. Absolute magic. I often stop and look at the brick on my house. How straight and level it is, how from bottom to top its consistent, 40 foot run and that mortar line doesn't even waver. There's no way in hell I or anyone I know could do that with such perfection. A skill that's worth every damn penny and name your price I'm paying it. Metal fabricators and welders, absolutely. Vehicle mechanics that know how to find electrical issues, land clearing and heavy equipment operators, plumbers that design and plumb out new construction. WORTH every penny they charge. Some guy with pooppickers llc at $190 an hour. $900 to replace a customer supplied toilet? GTFOH.

 

[Jackalope]

Another one. I have yet to meet an HVAC guy that can explain this to me.

Call a guy to do a fan motor replacement. $125 service call fee, $150 an hour labor rate x 2 hours. Add $300 fan motor +30% so $390. Total out the door $425 labor + $390 in parts.


Het a quote to replace a system. $12,000.

Equipment cost 5k. So $6,600 with the 30% added. The job takes 6 hours. OK fine, charge 8 hours to cover the whole day because most of the day is shot. 8×$150 labor rate =1,200 labor. The whole replacement based on their labor and parts rate should cost $7,800. Yet you're quoting me $12,000. $4,200 over their normal rates.

I know the answer. Because they can and people.pay it. No other reason.

It's for that reason that I've done 4 of them myself. I was more than willing to pay a guy a fair rate to do them. Not a rate I decided it's a rate they work off of every day on repairs, but I'm not going to get fucked over.

Companies charging 600, 700, 800 to replace a $30 capacitor. Three wires and a couple screws. kiss my ass.

 

[md1]

This.

Supply and demand ultimately control the free market in our wonderful capitalist society. A customer "win" is not getting cheaper labor at your expense. Customer truly wins by hiring someone competent that they trust for a price they are willing to pay. You win by becoming the guy who can charge whatever he feels is appropriate to do the job right because of his reputation and experience. Sacrificing your own earnings/wages/success in the name of morality and fairness because you feel bad about making good money is dumb. Sorry to be so blunt, but business is business. On being fair, like Mike said, just be honest. Be honest with yourself first, though.

Good to be blunt sometimes. This year will be my first full year of work for myself. The last two years was for my parents whole home, close friends and other family and alot of time for my own home and a few bid jobs for full price. Family and friends has been a lesson in itself. Transitioning from the commercial world as an hourly throw away number employee to having a chance of self gain (besides running some work) is alot to take in. My quote for feeling bad about making good money justs comes from receiving the few payments for bid jobs I've done that's double anything I've ever made and it's no where freaking close to where I think top dollar or a high hourly rate. I can't help but feel like I'm doing something wrong, bewildered that this is reality. Working for those companies dealing with money and keeping jobs on budgets was almost like playing monopoly, just a game cause it didn't matter what happened as long as you don't lose, but never get anything for winning. Dealing with people on a personal level with their money is new to me (besides 20yrs of side jobs that was just play money not my lively hood). I just don't want to cheat anyone and have them pay more than what my work and what I'm worth, which I don't know yet, I just know what it costs to operate. Competition just say for fake thin stone Amish and Mexicans 10 a square ft, a few city guys are over 20 and the so called expert sweet talking bullshitter around here is 35plus and the occasional outrageous throw it out there bids see if people bite prices happen around from time to time. That's about all I know of the competition. Where do I even begin? Am I as good as any of them, experience, quality, absolutely. Got a bit of reputation here with side work but not enough yet....Time will tell where I end up in this messy ass chaos I guess.

 

[hickslawns]

Be sure to figure in everything. Truck, tools, insurance, license plates,repairs, advertising costs, office time, bidding time, material pick up time. Unexpected expenses. What about the load of materials that falls and you bust a bunch of tiles? Did you get unemployment in slow times? Because your hourly rate that seems high when you bid, but carries you thru some slow times doesn't seem so high as you watch your account drain down. Hopefully you won't have any slow times. My work is very weather dependent. Maybe you can keep inside jobs lined up for winter months or rainy days. Don't forget to factor in taxes. Take the jobs you make out a little better and stuff some money away. There will be a job you underbid in time and have to eat some. Happens to everyone once in awhile. More frequently when you first start to bid the jobs.

I'm not saying to rip people off. It just seems like there is a lot of stuff we forget to factor in when starting out bidding jobs. I like what @finelyshedded said. If you find yourself doing exceptionally well, there is nothing wrong with tithing more or just handing an envelope to a family in need. Or wait until tax time. They will take excessively. Lol

 

[5Cent]

If you build it, they will come. High quality work, built on reputation, will command whatever price you deem fit. I know you're just asking around, but one size does not fit all. Go get it and adjust accordingly as you gain info. Good luck!