Made in China vs USA.

[Blan37]

Absolutely. They'll rip you off if they can manufacture the same end product cheaper. It doesn't even need to be made in china, look at Yetis hard coolers. Made in the USA, shitons of Chinese knockoffs are around. Most not even sold by a Chinese company but rather other US companies who had them made in china.

I'm not hopeful that our manufacturers will step up if we pull away from China. I think they'll do what capitalism has taught them to do when faced with a lack of competition and that is make profits. I have little hope that if we banned the sale of binders made anywhere but America that any manufacturer would produce a $9 binder. Rather the price would go up exponentially.

And there's Spyderco....

I own both of these. One is real, the other is fake. Both are good quality and if you don't know what to look for it can be hard to know which is the knockoff.

I purposely bought a fake from Ali Express so I could tell the difference and have a cheap beater knife.

This is an example of what happens to a good company that can't resist the siren call of China. They save a few bucks up front but screw their brand with a bad rep and lose their own market share to people who sell the fakes.

Y

 

[Blan37]

Yeah. One's things for sure it didn't happen overnight. How do we start to untangle that web, or is it even possible at this point. Back when your grandpa bought that knife china was getting owned by Japan and being sold as war whores to the Japanese army.

Genie is out of the bottle. she ain't going back in without a fight - there's too much symbiosis at this point. And people don't care... most people anyway..

They want cheap stuff, couldn't care less about untangling a web that to them is a benefit to be had, not a problem to be solved.

 

[Clay Showalter]

Lack of manufacturing capability will be the downfall of this country, look at current issues with medicine production. If China cut us off right now, we would be screwed, it takes time to get manufacturing back and up and running, I fear it is too far gone.

 

[brock ratcliff]

I don’t see Trump letting the Chinese handle our essentials anymore. I love that guy. A normal useless politician would just write it off as “how it is”, I don’t think Trump will. No one with any sense would, especially after they threatened to cut off our medical supply. Screw them. They can’t feed themselves, I hope they enjoy their rock and fish head soup.

 

[giles]

This is just a very small scale of what is happening. And why.

Also, why it should stop.

Screw China! They don’t give two shits about their own people. What makes you think they give a shit about the product?

Riddle me this though. How are we to rebound when people are making $1,000+ a week sitting on their asses right now? With a deferred mortgage payment.

I fear we haven’t even seen the tip yet.

 

[Jackalope]

And there's Spyderco....

I own both of these. One is real, the other is fake. Both are good quality and if you don't know what to look for it can be hard to know which is the knockoff.

I purposely bought a fake from Ali Express so I could tell the difference and have a cheap beater knife.

This is an example of what happens to a good company that can't resist the siren call of China. They save a few bucks up front but screw their brand with a bad rep and lose their own market share to people who sell the fakes.

Y

Curious. What was the cost of the two knives?

 

[Mike]

This is just a very small scale of what is happening. And why.

Also, why it should stop.

Screw China! They don’t give two shits about their own people. What makes you think they give a shit about the product?

Riddle me this though. How are we to rebound when people are making $1,000+ a week sitting on their asses right now? With a deferred mortgage payment.

I fear we haven’t even seen the tip yet.

Neighbor is making more sitting at home than he was making at work. WTF is that? I'm making less (cut hours) and I'm working!

 

[Blan37]

Curious. What was the cost of the two knives?

This was way back in 2014, but the knockoff was just under $20. The legit one was around $130.

 

[giles]

Neighbor is making more sitting at home than he was making at work. WTF is that? I'm making less (cut hours) and I'm working!

I hear ya brother...I hear ya.

 

["J"]

I fear we haven’t even seen the tip yet.

Oh you’ve gotten the tip, watch out for the shaft.....

 

[brock ratcliff]

Neighbor is making more sitting at home than he was making at work. WTF is that? I'm making less (cut hours) and I'm working!

You can file for lost wages. I’ve never filed but I know with this current situation they will supposedly make up the difference.

 

[Mike]

You can file for lost wages. I’ve never filed but I know with this current situation they will supposedly make up the difference.

I'm either too proud or too stupid to do that, Brock. It's not hurting us, but it's the point of it all.

 

[brock ratcliff]

I’ve always been the same. I’ll tell you a story along those lines over a fire one of these days. Still, it’s available if you opt to look into it.

 

[Jackalope]

I'm either too proud or too stupid to do that, Brock. It's not hurting us, but it's the point of it all.

You can also file as a sole proprietor if your inspection business has taken a hit. Nothing to be ashamed of, as a hardworking taxpaying American it's your money that you paid in taxes.

 

[Sgt Fury]

Neighbor is making more sitting at home than he was making at work. WTF is that? I'm making less (cut hours) and I'm working!

 

[hickslawns]

@Mike My understanding is they will pay if hours are cut. If you normally work 40hrs but are getting 20hrs the unemployment pays the other 20hrs. If you normally work 60hrs and are reduced to 20hrs, you will only be paid up to 40hrs. They don't make up lost overtime. First time ever to pay for "reduced hours" from my understanding. Hopefully your employer filed for PPP and received his "loan." It is to pay employees to keep them fully employed. Based on last year's payroll. We filed for it and received it. I do not draw a payroll check so I am left with reduced income. I told my guys to eat up any overtime they wanted. If the government is willing to help out the small business by assisting in payroll, my reduced income will be offset by reduced payroll expenses. It is there for the benefit of the employees. I care about my guys and want to keep them fully employed. I want to see them use it all.

 

[Blan37]

Came across an article on Fox News from an interview with Sen. Rick Scott. I like this guy.

"...they're anti-American, they want world domination. They're not a competitor, they are an adversary now.

As for holding China accountable for its role in the pandemic, Scott said the biggest way Americans can hit back is by refusing to engage in commerce with the Communist regime.

"The biggest thing we can do is stop buying their stuff," he continued. "They steal our jobs, they steal our technology and now they've intentionally caused a problem that's killing American jobs, killing Americans and Europeans and people all over the world.

"So I think the biggest thing we can do is make sure Americans stop buying their products. And it's a twofer because then we help build our own economy up again by bringing manufacturing back here."

But to Joe's point, we need affordable (and quality) products. Not sure how we compete with slave labor...

 

[Jackalope]

Update on this. So my wife reached out to about 15 US based manufacturers and received responses from about 6. Of those 6 prices ranged from about $35 to $70 per piece.

She's been moving forward with a Chinese manufacturer and paid for a proof to be made and shipped. $125. The final price per binder is $8 per piece shipped door to door, minimum 100 piece order.

As for binder go it's just about everything for a higher end quality product. Cloth-covered turned edge, debossed branding (impression) with gold foil stamped inlay, branding on both the spine and cover.

 

[brock ratcliff]

Looks good. Another cost you will likely incur; a percentage of product will likely be junk. It’s easy to get a couple for proof that are top quality. Once product starts coming in volume, quality may drop. You might wind up as bad as 50% that are unusable. You may not, but even if it is that high, you are still at 16/per. My experience with the smokers is all I have to draw on here. There is no return policy with China and it isn’t like you can Connie Lee down the street and gripe. Btw, everyone I ever dealt with was named Connie or Joe Lee, and never the same person twice.

 

[Jackalope]

Looks good. Another cost you will likely incur; a percentage of product will likely be junk. It’s easy to get a couple for proof that are top quality. Once product starts coming in volume, quality may drop. You might wind up as bad as 50% that are unusable. You may not, but even if it is that high, you are still at 16/per. My experience with the smokers is all I have to draw on here. There is no return policy with China and it isn’t like you can Connie Lee down the street and gripe. Btw, everyone I ever dealt with was named Connie or Joe Lee, and never the same person twice.

Awesome advice Brock. We read a similar statement about problems and the recommendation was to either hire a QC engineer to inspect the order onsite before shipment, use alibaba escrow where payment isn't released until we inspect and accept the order upon arrival, or use a sourcing company. We're going through alibaba marketplace which is kind of like a Etsy for Chinese businesses. They are rated by their customers like Ebay so you can see how long they've been around and read reviews. We are buying from what's called a sourcing company. They aren't the manufacturer but rather deal with design, production, and handle logistics. So there's the added desire for them to obtain and ship a quality product else what good are they as a sourcing company. I am sure we're paying more than if we simply went direct to the manufacturer but we're still only 22% of a US produced product.

Another interesting thing is we can actually source the binder insert divider tabs for cheaper here in town from a local printing company than we can from China. Typical heavy card stock, custom printed tabs, reinforced binder holes, custom colors etc. 4.75 per 10, china quoted us 7.75 per 10.