Nothing about Nothing

[Sgt Fury]

I’m afraid to post now....but I’ll test the waters...I’d this ok?

 

[giles]

 

[rooster85]

WTF? Lol


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[Sgt Fury]

Your browser history must be all over the place!

 

[Matt]

If you don't like something then do what you want Matt. We're not in the business of censoring members over harmless pictures that in the scope of things don't matter. If Chris Rock posted it people would laugh, look back through this thread an see how many redneck cousin fucker jokes were posted. It's the same shit. Cast your judgement on that person, ignore that person, take off for the hills if you like, but don't think for a second that we're going to censor someone because someone got their feelings hurt over a joke.

If we want to claim racist stereotypes aren't funny then this pic should offend you just as much as the other thing did.
View attachment 72786

I see your point Joe, but I think it ignores the nuance of the issue. I'm not asking you to censor anyone, nor would I ever ask that. I know what this place is about, and the members will police themselves and thin out the views they don't seem acceptable. If someone came in touting hyper-liberal pro-abortion, anti-gun viewpoints, the members would make it known eventually that those types of views were not acceptable for this kind of group. I'm not asking you to establish the line, I need to know what the group as a whole believes. Is this a place where any new hunters would feel welcome? If the consensus is that the picture was simply a joke and not racist or offensive, then I am sorry that I have to disagree with the consensus and this isn't the place for me. Just as the group would weed out the hyper-liberal, they would have to weed out my perspective as well.

And to be fair, if this was a website with primarily black individuals and someone posted the picture you did, and I was a white person looking to learn more about whatever cause their site was promoting, then yes. That would definitely give me the sense that I was not welcome there, and I would move on. In my opinion it creates the wrong sense of "us" and "them."

 

[Jackalope]

Alright, so I guess I need to lay it out where I am coming from here. I was raised a casual hunter; deer, rabbit, squirrels every once and a while. Then towards the end of college, I discovered the "other" site and began to be exposed to a much greater passion for hunting along the way. I became fairly good friends with a core group of guys there and made the journey away from that site, to another site, and eventually here to TOO. All along the way, the guys in these places helped me, mentored me, exposed me to a greater passion for the outdoors. We drank beers together, shot bows, caught fish, Jesse and Geezer even got me my first compound bow. I developed a great passion because of the mentorship I recieved. I reached a point in my life that was full of crisis, and change, and I felt that for the time I had the knowledge I needed and drifted away. As time has gone on, I realized that the passion these guys had sparked in me grew more and more and I realized I wanted to help inspire that passion in other people. I've introduced a few friends to hunting, and now I've set my sights on something bigger. I'm a high school teacher, and just started my schools first outdoors club, and we had 17 kids show up, eager to be involved. I wanted to come back to TOO for two reasons. One, I hope that I can be that inspiration to people like Jesse, Geezer, and a lot of these other guys have been to me. And two, I wanted to see if this was a place where I could hopefully point those kids to (as they go beyond graduation) so they may also be inspired. I'm not going to go back and delete any posts, because if I'm going to stay, I want the conversation to stay as a reminder to others. I can't change you guys, I can't. But the question I am asking, and need an answer to is this: is that picture over the line? It crosses my threshold of what I can ignore. It goes beyond being offensive to someone's political views. Is it the most offensive thing that could be posted? Of course not. But it's a line nonetheless. We all have lines, the question is, where is TOO's line?

And before you think that I am somehow some easily-triggered snowflake, remember that I also spend two straight months every summer as a commercial fisherman, surrounded by other fishermen who are much more coarse, and salty, and offensive than anyone I spend time with in a high school setting. And I get along with them just fine.

TOO is still the greatest forum with the greatest members that have ever existed on the Internet. I have seen members pool funds to purchase bows for children, take up donations to hand members who've had a rough year a 4 digit enveloped of cash to buy christmas presents for their children, we've taken up donatioms to give the present of family pictures before a love one with a terminal illness passes, the countless donations for flowers to a members family members funeral, people drive across state to attend the funeral of a member they've never met who lost a loved one. I've seen members kids given bows, handmade calls, and countless other gear. I've seen members invite other members and their kid to come shoot a deer after they we're having trouble getting them on a deer. I have seen more compassionate giving and greatnes from these members for youth than you will ever know. Even when you posted your idea many people offered to help and all you need do is ask. So before you question the value and impact of the people and this site perhaps you should do some reading. If all of that is worthless because you got your shit in a wad over a stupid picture then I don't know what to say. This site has been and will always be the same with the same great members, and yes, that includes the occasional "offensive" joke. If you don't want to be associated with the greatest bunch of guys ever gathered on the internet because of one persons post, then go find a safe place where you aren't triggered and offended.

 

[giles]

Damnit...now I’m into this.

Do I get upset when people post the Mexican word of the day? Nope, it’s a joke and it’s funny. Kids need to be exposed to things to help them grow into adults. It’s their choice to choose right from wrong.

You separating yourself over a single post is just stupid in my eyes. Thousands and thousands of great post on here with even better people. I understand sometimes we have bad days and I hope that’s all this is.

 

[Matt]

I'm sorry that you guys perceive this as me having a bad day, or being triggered and offended. This is truly a great site that does great things, I full well know and understand that. But I'm thinking of the black kid who I have sitting in my class, who wants to learn more about the outdoors and what I'm interested in. And one of the first things that pops up when he Google's my name is that I had the TOO buck of the month a llooooonggg time ago. So he signs up, starts reading, notices a racist post and just shrugs his shoulders and keeps scrolling the forum trying to think nothing of it. But then he notices another. And another. And another. And before he can even get to know this group of wonderful individuals, he starts to think that this is the identity of the group. And he starts to wonder that maybe his teacher holds that identity too since he didn't speak up. And a kid who could have maybe been brought into the fold, and discovered what the outdoors and this site is REALLY about, has been lost. I'm not going to lose my job over being a member here, I'm not worried about that. But if my primary purpose is to bring my students here, then I'm sorry if I'm being a bit protective of the first impressions they get of the outdoor world. There are other groups I can steer them to.

 

[Dannmann801]

 

[ILUVBIG8S]

Damnit...now I’m into this.

Do I get upset when people post the Mexican word of the day? Nope, it’s a joke and it’s funny. Kids need to be exposed to things to help them grow into adults. It’s their choice to choose right from wrong.

You separating yourself over a single post is just stupid in my eyes. Thousands and thousands of great post on here with even better people. I understand sometimes we have bad days and I hope that’s all this is.

[emoji51][emoji51][emoji51] black guy in whiteface stereotyping Mexicans!


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[Jackalope]

I'm sorry that you guys perceive this as me having a bad day, or being triggered and offended. This is truly a great site that does great things, I full well know and understand that. But I'm thinking of the black kid who I have sitting in my class, who wants to learn more about the outdoors and what I'm interested in. And one of the first things that pops up when he Google's my name is that I had the TOO buck of the month a llooooonggg time ago. So he signs up, starts reading, notices a racist post and just shrugs his shoulders and keeps scrolling the forum trying to think nothing of it. But then he notices another. And another. And another. And before he can even get to know this group of wonderful individuals, he starts to think that this is the identity of the group. And he starts to wonder that maybe his teacher holds that identity too since he didn't speak up. And a kid who could have maybe been brought into the fold, and discovered what the outdoors and this site is REALLY about, has been lost. I'm not going to lose my job over being a member here, I'm not worried about that. But if my primary purpose is to bring my students here, then I'm sorry if I'm being a bit protective of the first impressions they get of the outdoor world. There are other groups I can steer them to.

. An off colored joke is the least of that kids worries if he's browsing the internet unsupervised reading threads clearly labeled NSFW. . If you don't want your actual name associate with TOO I get that. I can and have anonymized a few members here. But it's no different that you being on Facebook and someone else being on Facebook posting something offensive. You're not held liable for that. I am in no way steering the direction of this site based on what some unsupervised child may see on the internet. He's not my concern, my target audience, or child. Censorship has and always will lead to bad things. The entire reason this site was created was to get away from a site that censored the shit out of people to pander to advertisers and make money. Look around, do see any adds? And it's worked. In just 9 years our monthly post contributions are six times theirs. And to your point about liberalism and being ran off, I wouldnt run over to liberal Reddit and start posting MAGA for the same reason.

Such is life man. Ignore and and move on or do what you think is right in your mind.

 

[Dannmann801]

Maybe kids need to learn that real life is not a fucking Benneton commercial. Maybe kids need to learn that there are cultural and social differences that DO exist between races, and between classes and economic strata within races.

All I know is that given the chance to mentor a little white hunter, I'd mentor the shit out of them. I'd do the same for a little black hunter. And for either of them, what they'd learn is not just outdoor skills, but how to act like a man among men.

I'm weary of division. Really starting to chafe on me as a white male.

 

[Mike]

There is a stark difference between pure hatred of race and sterotyping memes. I personally find jokes of race funny. So does Chapelle, one of my favs. I say this as a sponsor of a black as night Ethiopian Muslim girl and her family for the past 6 years.

 

[giles]

[emoji51][emoji51][emoji51] black guy in whiteface stereotyping Mexicans!


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That was the last 4 pintos!

 

[Matt]

Like I said Joe, I'm not asking, nor would I expect you to censor. It's the group mentality, as it should be. With that in mind, I have to consider what my role is here, and what I intend to do. I suppose my next move then is to just see if perhaps I've said anything to at least cause some pause in what people post. I doubt it though. Perhaps I responded too impulsively with me potentially leaving completely, but it does still give me pause whether this will be something I can connect my students with.

 

[ILUVBIG8S]

In all honesty, I think this is the point that I'm trying to make. If your implying that I am somehow offended by "everything" because I call out a racist, stereotyping photo as such, this is where I need to ask the question if this is the appropriate place I can be associated with. If a group of people can't find the nuance and distinction between posting politically offending material and a post that refers to black people as yard apes, then it's where I have to take my leave.

Matt I mean no harm in my post. Hell I almost never post anything, even after killing the biggest deer of my life this year [emoji6], however your post just triggered me a little bit. I read this forum to decompress, maybe get a laugh, and even sometimes pick up a little nugget of valuable info. Not a fan of being lectured or judge for something I may or may not have found funny. One thing I can tell you from my time here is that there isn’t a single member posting here that has an ounce of hate in their heart, well maybe some towards the DNR!! It was a funny “stereotype” meme meant for a laugh and nothing more. Trust me the kids your teach have seen and heard worse. In the words of the late great colonel sanders...”I’m to drunk to taste this chicken”


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[giles]

 

[giles]

“I’ll have a coke”

 

[Sgt Fury]

I was listening to the Stern show a while back and this topic came up. Comedians were being called out on stuff they did 20 or 30 years ago. Racists, homophobic jokes were being used to paint a picture of the comedians “beliefs”. Bottom line is that they said people go to see comedians to be entertained. There was no hate. Comedy should not be judged by today’s politically correct policy. Look at the older tv shows....All in the Family, The Jefferson’s, Good Times, Sanford and Son....they all poked fun at race issues. Comedian David Chappell’s comedy attacked both black and white people. Keye and Peele are two of my most favorite comedians. Their shows are not intended to spread hate, only to make people laugh. There is a difference between comedy and hate. I understand Matts reservations about steering high school students to a site that has no censorship, but hopefully they are mature enough to know the difference. Look at Mel Brooks classic Blazing Saddles...great comedy! Could they make that movie today? No way! When you see a rerun of that movie today, they bleep out all of the “offensive” dialogue. My opinion is that they should play the movie as is, and if someone is offended, they can change the channel. I have black coworkers who tell racist jokes all the time. I’ll tell them myself. As long as it is meant as comedy and not used in a hateful manner, it should be accepted for what it was intended. I am also smart enough to know when, where and to whom I can joke around with this way. That being said, I’ve censored myself from posting stuff on here because it crossed “my line”....and I’ve posted some pretty f’d up shit, so you know they must’ve been bad. I don’t judge anyone’s jokes/memes on here. It has absolutely no reflection on what that persons beliefs are, I take it as it was intended for....comedy.

 

[Outdoorsfellar]