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Riddle me this..

Jackalope

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I'm not one for most conspiracy theories.. But i do ask questions when 2+2 doesn't make 4... There has been an awful amount of recanting from earlier statements about the bin laden op.. Like, he used his wife as a human shield, they killed his wife, etc. But now they say, she wasn't used as a human shield but rushed them, and, she wasn't killed, only shot in the leg. Sounds like some details that shouldn't have got messed up, especially when they were watching a live feed from the helmet cam of the soldiers themselves. But the biggest burning question to me is a logistical one..

I've ridden in UH-60 Black hawks while in the Army. And this one question nags at me.. They at first said the sent 4 UH-60s.. Now they say only 2.. We know one crashed. Here is my question..

1 pilot, 1 Co-Pilot, 2 Crew Chiefs. This is the standard crew for a BH. Granted they may have left 1 crew chief. Lets assume they did..

Plus as they said 24 SEALs..
Plus 1 dead asshole.
Plus all the intel. I mean boxes of shit, I bet they took everything made of paper right down to the TV Guide..


SO.. The question becomes.. How do you fit 30 soldiers in full battle rattle, and 1 dead guy, with captured intel, into 1 UH-60?

Here is 9 in frame to give you a good idea of how tight that is. I have seen them carry 11+crew for 14.. But 30 + intel + 1 E-KIA? Christ sakes. It's not a clown car. :smiley_chinrub:

tumblr_ljg6cnLZDC1qgylqao1_400.jpg

Just a question i think is interesting.. That's all... Maybe they sling loaded the 2nd crew. "Everybody in the Net!"" rotflmao

army.mil-50820-2009-09-18-100955.jpg
 

RedCloud

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Could they or would they have sent the body and papers out on one chopper with a few guys and come back for a second pickup of the remaining seals ?

Not something I would think they would want to do but the only other way I could see them doing it lol.
 

Jackalope

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Could they or would they have sent the body and papers out on one chopper with a few guys and come back for a second pickup of the remaining seals ?

Not something I would think they would want to do but the only other way I could see them doing it lol.

Not likely. Unless they took off from somewhere inside Pakistan. The report is the two UH-60s took off from an airbase in Afghanistan. The compound is 160 miles from the afghan border. It wasn't exactly a hop skip and a jump. Max speed is around 160 miles an hour naked. We know they were on deck for 40 minutes.

I can't fathom they wouldn't have had some type of contingency plan for a downed BH though.. They learned that lesson pretty harshly in the Mogue. But the dollars still aren't making cents.
 

DJK Frank 16

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Joe, I read somewhere (I will try to find the article again) that there were two choppers in the air for support, once the first crashed they landed one of the ones that was there for support. Not sure how reliable the source for the article was but I guess that could be one way they pulled it off.
 

Huckleberry Finn

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Plus all the intel. I mean boxes of shit, I bet they took everything made of paper right down to the TV Guide..

Do you really think that they brought the paperwork? If so, that's fuggin crazy!

Also, I didn't even know that it was confirmed that they used Black Hawks, figured it was something else crazy.
 

RedCloud

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Not likely. Unless they took off from somewhere inside Pakistan. The report is the two UH-60s took off from an airbase in Afghanistan. The compound is 160 miles from the afghan border. It wasn't exactly a hop skip and a jump. Max speed is around 160 miles an hour naked. We know they were on deck for 40 minutes.

Guess that blows that idea out of the water lmao.

They had to have sent more then those 2 choppers. Maybe sent 2 in that first contact wave and 4 more for a follow up wave since one was in the first wave was damaged ? maybe that's how the media got screwed up on numbers of choppers ? IDK lmao. Just thinking outloud here lol
 

Jackalope

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Do you really think that they brought the paperwork? If so, that's fuggin crazy!

Also, I didn't even know that it was confirmed that they used Black Hawks, figured it was something else crazy.

No Dummy. lmao. Not the paperwork for the OP... Intel from the compound, paper, ledgers, journals, anything that may be intel etc , i bet right down to the trash in the kitchen was taken. Intel.

That's what they have said... The only other thing they could have used was CH-47 Chinooks. Which 1 of those could very easily carry 31 people plus intel... They do use them sometimes. But it doesn't appear that's what was used here. They aren't exactly discrete, The crashed one is the tail section of a BH or BH variant. Chinooks don't have tails.
 

Jackalope

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I think that just about explains everything.

Think again. "Variant" doesn't mean "capable of carrying 30+ men in full battle rattle + intel." There are many specialized variants of the BH suited for specialized tasks. But they are all basically on the same airframe. You can't fit 20 people in a PT cruiser or a dodge Neon even though both are variants on the same frame.

We're talking about fitting the carrying capacity of the Top helicopter (CH-47 Chinook) into the airframe of the bottom helicopter (UH-60 BH)



While the tail section left at the compound does appear to be something we have never seen before. I.E a stealthier BH. It doesn't look to be larger than normal and about the same sized tail section for that airframe.
 

Dannmann801

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I wonder if the helicopters were black?:smiley_clap:

There had to be backups in place - there's no way they didn't plan for every contingency with redundancies to their redundancies.
I'd think they've come a long way since the failure in the desert during the Iran hostage crisis.
 

hickslawns

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I have flown in a blackhawk. First I must say, they are amazing and it was friggin' awesome! Second, I am saying packed in like sardines you are going to need 3 minimum. My neighbor (retired guy and formerly a Navy guy) has nothing to do but wax his Vette, mow his lawn, and keep up on this stuff. Great guy, full of information. He said something about fueling while en route or in the air. I never heard this, but don't doubt him as I am sure he watched every bit of coverage there was available. That was a pretty long haul from the launch point to nearly the center of Pakistan. Dang you Jackalope! Now you have me wondering.
 

hickslawns

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Yep. I was in Basic Training when it happened. Talk about a rough day. Those DI's were NOT in a good mood that morning. Smoked the crap out of us and went on about "my job is to train you to become soldiers. There was American blood shed yesterday and I am not going to let you bunch of maggots fail." Upon the completion of our butt kicking, the Drill Sargent explained a bit about what happened and how he had just come off a rotation with a Ranger unit. Looking from his perspective, it all started to make sense. Those were guys he was serving with months prior. I will never forget those bastards in Somali.
 

epe

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Also, if they had cameras how did it go from "he had a weapon and fired on the soldiers", to "he was unarmed"?

sent from my HTC evo
 

finelyshedded

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Listening TOO my radio on the way home from work this morning, they reported that the helicopter that was destroyed, was a top secret stealth model that had 5 rotors that were designed to reduce noise. There was a mechanical problem and the one chopper couldn't get up so they tried to skuddle it but a large portion of the tail was still pretty much intact. The Packies found it and hauled it away, which is scary because if China or any other country for that matter antes up some serious coin, they can tear it down and steal our tech. secrets. This particular stealth helicopter has never been seen by the public and few even knew we had them. At least that's what they said on the radio report. As far as their carrying capacity, that was never mentioned. I just read a report that said we're on shakey ground with the Packo's after this raid and that they(Pakistian's Gov/army) were embarrassed by the US because we came into their country without them knowing it and by the time they found out and scrambled 2 of their F-16's we had already killed the towel head and got back into Afganistan. LOL Gotta love our Military. Another note: This compound was right next TOO a Packy military acadamy and THEY didn't know about what had happened till out SEALS were gone! FUGGIN A!
 

Jackalope

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ive called the whole bin laden dead thing a hoax from the get go . he is using it for a re election tactic

I don't know about that. I prefer to think we got him. There are just a bunch of questions that aren't adding up. The are changing major details from their initial statement. Details that should have been blatantly obvious considering they saw exactly what the soldiers saw live.
 
the reason i say its a hoax is cause obama is shady in the first place , his birth certificate , his social security number belonging to a dead guy , and now this , even with sadam there was a a video , but with bin laden we got nothing but word of mouth
 

jagermeister

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I think we got him, and I'm fuckin glad we did... but the whole thing just wreaks of typical government bullshit. I think they knew he was there for a long time... basically in "jail"... they just went and got him now because Obama's ratings were in need of a boost before 2012. Think about it... what has he done to grant re-election so far? Not much, right? Well, up until bin Laden was killed at least. The indirect "look at what I did" statements during the announcement speach were just ridiculous. He (Obama) said that he was the one who made the decision on which of the two invasion strategies to go with... REALLY?!?! What the fuck does he know about invading a compound in Pakistan? He didn't make that call... they just said he did so it makes him look good. Just my opinion, of course.