Mike, I agree with a lot that you have to say. But consider this. I have never met you but know who you are and what you stand for. People are going to watch what they say and do more so around you. I on the other hand am just another face in the crowd.........I hear the REAL STORIES they tell. I know for a FACT that way TOO many deer are being taken by the "Poachers". Teetering on the Fence may be happening.....But when that fence is only 12" high, many just step on over it. I'm sorry but stat's are stat's on deer killed no matter how they are aquired. The ODNR has done a FABULOUS JOB since my first deer tag in 1977 ~~ So why "Pull The Plug" and let our herd go down the drain? Yes, the new system is working........But it is working just a little bit TOO WELL.
huntn2
Senior Member
I have said it before and after seeing the harvest reports this year will say it again, telecheck is not the problem...
Youth gun, gun week, bonus gun were all down, first 6 weeks of archery was down ...this doesn't exactly reflect an increase in rifles being used and deer being reported over the phone/internet.
Muzzy and the remaining archery weeks were up. Did everyone decide to do all their poaching outside of the main gun days?
How many deer were never tagged/checked in before? It was way easier for a landowner to shoot one out back, take it to the barn/garage and butcher it without leaving the house to go to a check station. Now the state has provided a method for these folks to report their harvest without a huge inconvienence.
Same goes for anyone really....how many just drive straight home before? Like rex said, if it is late at night/early in the morning, how many guys were driving all over to an open check station? My most convenient spots were Gander Mountains. Think their store hours worked well for me to check in something? Nope.
You shoot a turkey as soon as he hits the ground. It is just after 6am...let me wait 4 hours till a store opens. You shoot a deer at 5pm. Wait an hour, track, gut, drag it out. Load it and gear up...oh well, check station is closed...
These situations are far from uncommon. Telecheck gives these hunters a better opportunity to report the harvest...
Now back to what if anything the statistics are telling us about our States deer population.
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Youth gun, gun week, bonus gun were all down, first 6 weeks of archery was down ...this doesn't exactly reflect an increase in rifles being used and deer being reported over the phone/internet.
Muzzy and the remaining archery weeks were up. Did everyone decide to do all their poaching outside of the main gun days?
How many deer were never tagged/checked in before? It was way easier for a landowner to shoot one out back, take it to the barn/garage and butcher it without leaving the house to go to a check station. Now the state has provided a method for these folks to report their harvest without a huge inconvienence.
Same goes for anyone really....how many just drive straight home before? Like rex said, if it is late at night/early in the morning, how many guys were driving all over to an open check station? My most convenient spots were Gander Mountains. Think their store hours worked well for me to check in something? Nope.
You shoot a turkey as soon as he hits the ground. It is just after 6am...let me wait 4 hours till a store opens. You shoot a deer at 5pm. Wait an hour, track, gut, drag it out. Load it and gear up...oh well, check station is closed...
These situations are far from uncommon. Telecheck gives these hunters a better opportunity to report the harvest...
Now back to what if anything the statistics are telling us about our States deer population.
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I agree with most I think the telecheck makes it way too easy to poach. Sorry Mike, but if you think it will not increase poaching, you are not in touch with the people who would do it. There is a big difference in a trophy hunter, and someone doing it to feed their family..
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Truth is I don't blame them, if everything I claimed to base it on was found to be flawed and illogical i wouldn't release it anymore either. .. Especially if I was the one who change the method for which numbers we're calculated; and in doing so increased the estimation +150K between the 05 and 06.. And then another +100K between 06 and 07.. But hey, it sounded good for the 5 years they could use it every chance they got.
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huntn2
Senior Member
Rumor has it no herd population estimate will be made public going forward. Due to the complexity and therefore difficulty in herd estimation, the DOW is not able to accurately estimate the population. As a result, we won't be seeing a number for 2012...
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Ohiosam
*Supporting Member*
The local WO was at my sportsmans club meeting. He talked a little about deer numbers. He said at a recent meeting Tonk said that only 3 counties were within 25% of goal population. 85 counties were over the goal pop by at least 25%.
Columbiana county, with a 19% harvest decline, was between 25% and 50% over goal population.
Columbiana county, with a 19% harvest decline, was between 25% and 50% over goal population.
Milo
Tatonka guide.
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so how will the set bag limits? we don't know how many there are so we don't know how many we should have we don't know how many we should be killing..GGRRRRRRREEEAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTT...Sounds like Social Security
This is ludacris in itself. Instead of not releasing a population estimate based on flawed collection methods, how about a solution. Here is a novel idea: find a more accurate model to estimate the herd, implement it, and THEN release the information. Can't tell me there is no way to do so. With the infrared technology and such today, I am sure there has to be a better way. I just don't know what it is. That is not my job.
ohio mossy oak
Senior Member
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Doesn't matter. Never did.. Farmers and insurance companies will be the deciding factor in what happens with Ohio's deer population, just as they've done in the past... The herd estimation was just a ruse to make you believe we had too many deer and follow along. If the insurance agencies think they're hitting too many deer, and farmers think they're loosing too much crops, the herd will be killed further regardless of a population number. Every public chance they got for the last 5 years they claimed the population was at 750k. Unchanged. Regardless of the reduction efforts. The population doesn't matter Phil. It only matters that farmers and lobbyist are happy.. You can suck it.
True. True. True. I believe there is even a quote here somewhere stating this if I am not mistaken. Something along the lines of the farmers and insurance companies determining the harvest goals. My point though, is the fact there just about has to be a better way to determine the herd estimate.
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Strangely I have nothing to add here.
Anyone know a good ridge in Athens Co.? Maybe we should put together another deer camp in the area. They still have deer!
Anyone know a good ridge in Athens Co.? Maybe we should put together another deer camp in the area. They still have deer!
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I would like to know who is filling out the Farmer Attitude Surveys. Having asked my neighbor (likely the largest landowner in Highland County) and the guys I hunt on in Fayette County, no one has ever heard of it.
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From the data I found only 1,244 farmers participated in the telephone survey. It's in the other thread. And THEY are the ones who basically set the tone to reduce the population 9% the next season.
Basically here is what happens. The farmer takes the blame, the hunter gets lied to to make him think we have too many, the deer get slaughtered, insurance companies that lobby politicians are happy. In return the politicians are happy, they don't pressure the wildlife council, and the council and director not only keeps the biologist who keeps up the charade they give him many awards.
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ohio mossy oak
Senior Member
Just to go off topic..While I hate sharing FREE land with every tom,dick an harold..I have to give alot of respect to this local farmer..He refused to lease,does not want any crop damage permits..And allows anyone to hunt it that ask...Back to the debate
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Seems funny that a farmer attitude survey would have so much weight. Mrex is always quick to point out the obvious...hunters would just say MORE when surveyed...so wouldn't it stand to reason that farmers would say LESS when asked how many deer they want? Dumb. The whole thing is frustrating.